the democrats have a role because harry reid didn't get through filibuster reform. he should have so they held onto the process -- >> but that had nothing to do with what happened yesterday? >> but they are not the abusers, they are the enablers and the abusers are john mccain and people who don't want -- it sounds like rhetoric, literally don't want the post filled at the pentagon because of their grudges. >> julian, the senate will take up mr. hagel's nomination when it reconvenes in ten days atime but i want to bring in something from richard hass. here he is with our own joe scarborough. >> we're hearing in the end most likely he's going to pass and be secretary of defense, so why hold him up over a recess when the pentagon desperately needs somebody at the helm? >> because in a funny sort of way, joe, it's exactly what mccain said. it's a way of getting their pound of flesh. >> julian, pound of flesh. is that really what this is all about? given that our troops deserve a leader because they serve with every ounce of their bodies, they give their bodies. >> well